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OSCEOLA - 54 mm Romeo Models

Discussion in 'vBench (Works in Progress)' started by MAB, Apr 17, 2007.

  1. MAB Well-Known Member

    Daniel M.
    Daniel I.
    Jon and Benoit

    Wow.... Dear friends thanks to all for your comments...... I have them a lot appreciates .... this is my first Indian and is beautiful to see that all the job made from the team has had a good reply.
    Thanks to all from part mine and that one of Danilo and Marcello.

    For Mike - Thank you Mike for your compliments. About the Danilo's painting, you might have reason speaking of Seminoles in general. But Osceola has been painted exactly as presented in the portraits. Anyway, every painter will be able to paint it as he wants, with any garish colour, showing off his best fantasy.

    For Daniel M. - Thanks my friend ......... I Hope......:)

    For Daniel I - Thanks Daniel....... it is beautiful to see you here on Planet.

    Per Angelo - Grazie per il commento ........spero di continuare con queste brutte abitudini .....:D

    Per Luca - Grazie per il consiglio sicuramente lo attuerò sul prossimo pezzo anche perchè questo ormai è partito .....

    For Benoit - Thanks........ also your Gallic Warriors is much beautiful ..... compliments.

    Salute To All MAB :)
  2. Bruno New Member

    Hallo Maurizio,

    my highest compliment for your figurine and for the painting of Danilo Cartacci!!!

    But let me add some words on the historical note:

    It is the common method of white historians to name any victory of the Indians against white soldiers a "Massacre" - like "Grattan Massacre, or Custer Massacre" in turn, when a Indian village was attaced and men women and children where slaughtered it was named a "battle" - like the "Washita Battle".

    The so called "massacre" of Major Dade, was not a massacre. It was the defende of the Seminol people against an unjust attack and an unjust war executed against this people. Major Dade tries to kill Seminole and was killed by the Seminols. It was a battle but not a massacre.

    If you study the history of the Seminol wars, there are actions of the white soldiers against Seminol villages, which much more earne the reputation as "the worst episode of the war".

    Also the Seminols dont "went to life in Oklahoma" they weher forced against their will to go to Oklahoma.

    But in any case it is a beautiful figurine, a great worke!!!

    Many greetings

  3. marcellin de marbot New Member

    Hello Mr.Schmaeling,
    The sources I used to write the historical notes were written by white men, not by Seminoles, then it's normal they named the incident with Major Dude a "Massacre". What you said, is a famous phrase said by a great native chief. "When are the whites to win, they say that's is a battle, when are the natives to win, it's a massacre". Anyway, when almost a whole detachment of more 100 men is killed in battle, for me it's a massacre, whoever makes it, and whoever has the reason. And I am really on the side of the Native Americans, they were "massacred" all the time, with all the systems by white men during the Indian wars. For this reason I'm studying their life.
    For the other matter, in the notes there is clearly written that Seminoles were forced to go in Oklahoma for "removal" or "expatriation", owing to the removal policy of the US Government, they did not go as happy travelers.
    But of course you were obliged to say something at all costs, isn't true?
    Best regards
  4. garyjd Well-Known Member

    Maurizio, Very very nice. This is one of those figures that will paint itself.~Gary
  5. Bruno New Member

    Dear Mr. Grimaldi,

    thank you for your answer. It is interesting to hear, that you also see the Native American side of the American history, so it seams we are not so far awy from eache other...

    I do not be "obliged to say somthing to all costs"... Why should I???

    I'm study the history of the Native Americans since 30 years, my wife speaks the Lakota language, and we both write scholar articles for historical magazines in Germany and give scholar lessons in schools and universities about the culture and history of Plains Indians.
    For November I plan a symposium on a University with a leading American Historian in Munich who just published a book on Sitting Bull.

    In this way we have friends at different tribes like the Lakota, Onondaga, Delaware and others. We support two social projects on Lakota Reservations and worke with a language and culture programm on a Lakota Reservation.

    I know from our Native American friends, how they feel when their history ist shown only from the white men's view and as they not present in the forum, I alow myselfe to give a statment whenever I think somthing is not correct.

    Of course you can name a killing of 100 soldiers a "massacre", but in scholar historicall therm, at least in Germany, a "massacre" is the deliberate killing of people who cant defende themselfe. This was not happend with the soldiers of Major Dade, and it was surely not the "worst episode of the war".

    It was never my intention to quarrel with you or to insult anybody. You did a great job in the research of the figurine of Osceola!!!

    But regarding what the Native American had to suffer over centuries, I only wish white people should be more careful when they represent the history of the Native Americans.

    Perhapes we can meet each other on a Italian figurine show, Bolzano or Monte San Salvino, and talk about the matter with a glass of good Chianti?

    Best regards

  6. pkw4 Active Member

    questa figura mi piace molto.Sei un maestro
  7. Roc Active Member

    Maurizio, che bellissima scultura, un altro capolavoro.

  8. marcellin de marbot New Member

    Dear Mr. Schmaeling,
    When I was a child, I played many times with my "indian" figurines. At that time, I was already on the side of Native, while the movies of the 50's showed that they was always the bad, and the whites were always the right. Now, we all know the truth, Native Americans were removed from their lands, often killed without a reason, forced to be closed into small reserves, in name of a "civilization", that meant only power, money, and occupation of territories.
    I know you come often in Italy, then I think you know a little our language. In italian, the word "massacre" means the killing of many persons (during a battle, an ambush, whatever event). Then, I think that when more than 100 soldiers are killed in a battle from whoever, it's a massacre, not because some persons are the heroes and other murders. Perhaps you thought to name "massacre" when many soldiers kill a few enemies, but I give to that word another sense. Massacre was Sand Creek, massacre was Wounded Knee, but massacre was also Little Big Horn (also considering all the faults of Custer) where over 4000 Sioux (various tribes) Cheyenne, Blackfeet and allied "massacred" almost 300 men of US cavalry.
    I am absolutely not offended for your comment, I think only it's a little reductive to underline the meaning of some words, instead to appreciate the whole project, the work is behind, in sculpture and painting, the hours of research on American sites and books (I had given to Maurizio another part of research about the costumes and the dressing of Seminole, but he thought it was too much long to put it in this Forum). So I'll be happy to talk with you about Native Americans whenever and wherever it will be possible.
    Best regards
  9. Bluesking Active Member

    VERY SPECIAL indeed.
  10. spidy58 Member

    Ciao Maurizio avevo sentito parlare del seminole ma non lo avevo visto.....Woww!!!:eek: che dire di più, come hai detto tu continua con queste brutte abitudini........complimenti anche a Danilo per la sua sempre superba pittura.
    ciao e al prossimo masterpiece!
    ciao Roberto
  11. slaj Well-Known Member

    Ciao Marizio. Che ti devo dire? Incredibilmente bella la scultura, esaltata dall'ottima pittura da Danilo. I miei piu' sinceri complimenti ad entrambi

    Stephen Mallia
  12. MAB Well-Known Member

    Hi Gary - Bruno - Roberto - Roc - Stephen J - Roberto D.M. and Stephen M.
    Thank guys for your comment are well apreciate.
    Saluti to all MAB ;)
  13. Bruno New Member

    Dear Mr. Grimaldi,

    thank you for your answer. We are realy not far from eache other regarding the history of the Native Americans. Let us stop the philosophic discussion on the word "massacre" it seems that Italian and German language have different interpretations.

    Of course I do appreciate your work for the Oseceola figurine! I love to see historical correct Native American figurines, which represents this great culture and not the brainless common "Hollywood Stuff" made by other companies just for commercial reason.

    I did the research on the Pegaso Crow and Hidatsa and I had just finished the research of another Indian figurine for Pegaso. I know very well, how much work it is to get all the research, you have my highest respect!!!

    When I visit Luca Marchetti in the Summer I will of course get the Romeo Osceola, it will be a pleasure to paint!!! And of course I will reccomend this figurine to our German figurine scene!!!

    About Little Bighorn. This battle is a good example how white historians altered the facts for their view of history, when they wrote that 6000 or 4000 Indians killed the 260 men of Custer.

    According to new historians like Gregory F. Michino, Kignsley Bray, Jeffry Ostler (University of Oregon), Dietmar Kuegler and the Battlefield archeology, the united Lakota, Cheyenne as wella s a few Aprapahoe and Dakota and Nakota had at all not mor than 1200 - 1500 warriors. Around 300 stayed in the village to guard the women and children. Custer had at all around 600 men. If he had not split his command, the outcome of the battle could have been much different, which had ment the death of many Indian women and children.

    In this way I reccomend 2 books:
    Gregory F. Michino "Lakota Noon - Indian Narrative of Custer's Defeat"
    Kingsley M. Bray "Crazy Horse - A Lakota live"
    You will be delighted to read this books.

    So again, my congratulations for your worke and I hope to see more Indian figurines created by your research.

    Hetshetu (Lakota for "All right")

  14. marcellin de marbot New Member

    Dear Bruno,
    May I call you so? I read with interest your words about Little Big Horn, I think the doubt on the numbers comes from the matter that Custer had originally under his command the 7th regiment formed by the 600 men you say, but he spotted the regiment in three detachments, one commanded by himself, almost totally died (the legend tells all soldiers except the trumpeter Martini), and the other two detachments commanded by Majors Reno e Benteen. So, may be also the Native warriors were divided in more groups, then the identical doubt about their total amount. I found an american site with the names of many Native chiefs and warriors participating in the battle, very particular.
    I don't know if you have already seen the site "gutemberg" from which I took many informations about Seminole, it's very complete and interesting, there is a study made at the beginning of 1900

    Best regards
  15. Angaliel A Fixture


    this figure is really beautifful. A must have, at least in my collection :)

    I hope to get one copy soon and paint it before next St Vincent.
    I'll be happy to see you again MAB (with the nice Marcello) and show you my humble painted rendition of your great sculpt.

  16. Wendy Active Member

    :eek: Wow. I don't know how you sculptors do it. Very nice.
  17. Bruno New Member

    Dear Marcello,

    thank you very much for your answer and the link. I don't know this link and I will have a look.

    About Little Bighorn, I can only reccomend the book of Gregory Michino. It is the best book ever done.
    Custer tried at Little Bighorn his old tactics, to atttak the Indian Village on one side to cause the women and children to flee in the other direction and than to attac the women and children. He did this sucessfully at Washita, where 80% of all killed Cheyenne are women and children.
    But here he mistake how large the village was.
    He sent Captain Benthin away as it seemed that he don't wanted that Benthin take part in his victory. Custer hated Benthin, because Benthin had Custer accused in a letter to the supreme command of a participation in sexual abuse or even raping of Cheyenne women after the Battle of Washita.
    The case was put under the carpet, but Custer hated Benthin of course.

    But this is only a part of the story.

    I would be appreciated in a coopration, as we both support two companies which cooperat close together.

    Many greetings

  18. MAB Well-Known Member

    Hi JeanPaul and Wendy
    thanks for your comments .......and for the visit ....;)

    For JP - It will be a pleasure also for me... we look at ourselves to S, Vincent........... but I hope to before see the piece painted from you...... :D

    Saluti to all MAB :)
  19. DrLutz Member

    That's what I like in your work - great sculpting, exellent painting, photos of perfect quality and interesting story as well!
    Thanks a lot my friend!
  20. igor_belousov Active Member

    Wow. Beautifful figure and nice painting

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