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Oh NO!

Discussion in 'Reviews , Video Reviews and Open Book' started by Johan, Feb 7, 2004.

  1. Johan Well-Known Member

    Country:
    Belgium
    ... Well it was to be expected - "Western Samourai" they call it...

    Someone PLEASE do that Tokugawa Ieyasu figure QUICK !!!!

    [IMG]
  2. Patrick Kirk New Member

    Johan,
    Gotta agree...sometimes things are better left undone...
    Let me guess, Andrea?

    Hope all is well

    Patrick
  3. Johan Well-Known Member

    Country:
    Belgium
    Andrea's latest it is, indeed, Patrick. Well, I guess it's up to them what they want to do, but I would have thought a historically accurate samourai of the 19th century (about 1869) would be more interesting - I saw photo's of some and they look like interesting subject.
  4. Patrick Kirk New Member

    Johan,
    I gotta agree...a decked out samurai, to me, would be much more appealing...but hey, I guess they know their customer base better than us!
    Hope all is well...

    Patrick
  5. quang Active Member

    Country:
    Belgium
    Johan,

    There's no such thing as an 'historically accurate' samurai in that period . Let me explain.

    In the Meiji era (19th century), Japan was in peace for several centuries. As peace and stability endured, the merchant class (bourgeoisie) became richer and more powerful whereas the warrior class (samurai) became obsolete and lost all its former prestige (and wealth).

    It's in reaction to the modernization of the country (and their own sorry condition) that the members of the warrior class dressed themselves in 'samurai' attire. These are the guys we see in contemporary photographs. The issue is that after centuries of non-use, the old skills have disappeared with the last of the armourers and sword-makers. Add to that the drastically reduced budget of the patrons, the weapons and armour of that period were cheap, poorly-done reproductions of what might have been. A well-known fact among the historians and collectors.

    In short, what we see on the photographs are poorly dressed re-enactors. So when Mr. Cruise comes in to act as a foreigner re-enacting the re-enactors..., who can tell what's accurate and what's not?

    'Will the circle be unbroken...'

    Quang
  6. frank h Well-Known Member

    Country:
    England
    Hi Johan
    I enjoyed the film, Andrea bringing out the figure was only to be expected.

    Tom Cruise immortalised in a Spanish figure, wheres the harm?

    Still think his best role was in "Interview With The Vampire"

    Frank (y)
  7. Johan Well-Known Member

    Country:
    Belgium
    Quang, thank you for that insight. So if I'm correct, those "samourai" were only keeping up appearances? I never knew that, thought some of that tradition might still be "alive" at that time (ca. 1860ies) Thank you, I learned something again today. So by 1860 the Japanese samourai culture would be "decadent" in a way...

    Yes, I knew that after 1600 and the battle of eh.. sekigahara (?) there were more than 250 years of peace.

    ... But then..... what's the point of that movie with Tom Cruise, if he's reenacting the reenactors??? :lol: :lol: :lol: So the heroic events depicted in the movie never took place, hahahaha :lol: :lol: :lol: !


    Frank, of course there's no harm in producing a Tom Cruise figure ... and he does have some talents as an actor, I've seen worse - I like him in "a few good men".
    But really, is there a POINT in producing such a figure when we want this hobby to be the making and painting of "historical miniatures"? Unless we all agree here and now that from now on we'll include miniatures representing characters from cinematographic history as well - .... well, we might of course ... Laurel and Hardy as Legionnaires, well ok, why not. :lol: :lol: :lol:
  8. yeo_64 Active Member

    Country:
    Singapore
    I suppose it's meant for die-hard fans of Tom Cruise <_< who happen also to be modellers Something like the Elf Archer figure(Orlando Bloom),which I did up for a dear friend of mine for Christmas,and she was thrilled to bits Just my 2-cents worth.Cheers Kenneth.
  9. Kreston Active Member

    Country:
    United-States
    That is some interesting information, Quang. I sure would like to see you release an armored Samurai warrior!

    Kreston
  10. jitch0t Member

    Country:
    Spain
    if you guys don't like it, don't buy it, don't blame Andrea

    i liked the movie and i bought the fig, don't care if it's accourate or not... but as i can see, i don't have room here because i painted the Elf Archer and now this one and this hobby is for "historical miniatures"

    ok, see you
  11. Johan Well-Known Member

    Country:
    Belgium
    You misunderstood my posting there - at the end I tried to "build a bridge" to include cinematographic history as subject matter for historical miniatures - after all, the history of movies is history as well. That's why I mentioned that figures of Laurel and Hardy as legionnaires would be a good idea... I mean that.
  12. Guy A Fixture

    Country:
    United-States
    I believe this forom is for "Miniatures", whether they be historical, fantasy, or otherwise. I paint historical and fantasy, hollywood, and anything my eyes strike me as fun to paint. I have Star Trek figures as well as Napoleonic figures. I enjoy all aspects of the hobby of painting and sculpting and this forom covers all aspects of the hobby. "Anything Figure"
  13. Jason W. Active Member

    Country:
    United-States
    Hmmmmm...Thats an idea! ;) :lol: :lol: :lol: Thanks Johan

    I have just the head for Stan!

    Attached Files:

  14. Johan Well-Known Member

    Country:
    Belgium
    Jason man!!! Where did you get that pic!!! Thanks, you make my day! :lol: :lol: :lol:

    Oh it would be GREAT, a vignette of that! :lol: :lol: :lol:
  15. frank h Well-Known Member

    Country:
    England
    I take your point Johan
    But a figure is a figure where ever the history
    comes from.

    Frank (y)
  16. Jason W. Active Member

    Country:
    United-States
    Or how about this one

    Hey, these guy's were historically versatile :lol: :lol: :lol:

    Attached Files:

  17. jitch0t Member

    Country:
    Spain
    That's "building a bridge"? omg, sure

    well, no problem
  18. Johan Well-Known Member

    Country:
    Belgium
    ... :lol:

    Jason, I had forgotten about that one. Just wondering, aren't there actually any figures of them? <_<

    ... Well, I'll never forget Stan and Ollie as legionnaires... :lol: :lol: :lol:
  19. Dani A. New Member

    "Where's the harm?"

    I do not want to touch the question of quasi-historical, historical-fiction, or pseudo-historical cimenatographic or literary characters as opposed to accurate historical models; I think every option has his supporters, and that every option is perfectly acceptable. ALTHOUGH I believe these products are increasingly being equiparated to , and treated the same as, and (frequently) marketed (deceivingly) as, rigorous historical representations, which they are not.

    What I want to remark is that this is the umpteenth (and it will -no doubt- not be the last) example of Andrea casually vulnerating copyright.
    Although Andrea is not the only manufacturer doing it, this kind of stuff is very recurrent in his catalogue.
    Whatever name Andrea is giving these figures ("Elf Archer", "Western Samurai", "Arachnid", etc, etc), obviously the attempt is to draw a profit of a copyrighted image, for free.

    This is as I see it. And I personally find such procedures unacceptable, from Andrea or whoever.


    Dani
  20. jitch0t Member

    Country:
    Spain
    i guess everybody knows that these kind of figs are not historical representations, they are movie representations (you can even see a clapperboard in their boxes telling you it's a fig from a movie!)

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