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WIP Critique Maori Warrior, Pegaso bust, 1/9th scale

Discussion in 'vBench (Works in Progress)' started by tonydawe, Apr 15, 2013.

  1. PHIL WALDEN Member

    hi!..the Dawe, light skin/dark skin, remember the weight of the facial moko will give the apprance of a darker skin tone although l do feel he's a wee on the orange side, perhaps a very thin wash Van Dyke brown, or Raw umber,..mate when you hit on the Moko, best use 70% Van Dyke Brown, 20% Sap Green 10% Prussian Blue, wee high lights Naples yellow, mixed with Sap green espcialy nose and chin, DONT USE BLACK.....EVER...... cheers old son.
    Jamie Stokes likes this.
  2. tonydawe A Fixture

    Country:
    Australia
    Thanks Keith, I'm grateful for your comments

    Phil, The Master speaks.....thanks very much cobber.

    I will follow your recomendations as if they were carved into stone by the hand of God himself and carried down from Mt Sinai by Charlton Heston.
  3. John Belcher A Fixture

    Country:
    New_Zealand
    Hi Tony, nice start mate, you have had some great advice here. Look fordward to see him progress.
    Regards,John(y)
  4. Jimmy S Well-Known Member

    Country:
    Australia
  5. Mike - The Kiwi A Fixture

    Country:
    New_Zealand
    Ok mate painting is coming up nicely with smooth transitions.

    Remember we're only seeing colours as they appear on our monitor. With that said it still appears too yellow-ey to my eyes try adding a little Cad Red Light &/or vermillion to highlighted areas & some green e.g. Viridian or Chrome Oxide Green in to 'graying' the shadows.

    Hope this is helping mate. I know how tough it can be to understand this via the web, but give it a go & see what you think.
    I haven't come up with these mixes I followed the expertise in Flesh Colour Recipes book by William F Powell.

    Again good work on flesh brushwork though,

    Mike
  6. Einion Well-Known Member

    :X3: There should be no problem including black in mixes Phil, the problems arise when it's used to excess.

    Quite apart from the fact that you can mix perfectly good fleshtones using some black, perhaps you don't realise that many commercial Van Dyke Brown paints are made using black ;)

    Einion
  7. davidmitchell A Fixture

    Country:
    Scotland
    Looking great so far Tony , very smooth blending.


    Cheers David
  8. Jamie Stokes Well-Known Member

    Country:
    Australia
    Very good so far Tony, I can't really add much then others have already said....

    Always good to see a character study like this come to life!!

    Cheers
    Jamie
  9. tonydawe A Fixture

    Country:
    Australia
    Hi John,

    Thanks for your comments mate. Your Old Maori Warrior figure is one of the pieces that has provided inspiration for this bust.
  10. tonydawe A Fixture

    Country:
    Australia
    Hi Jimmy,

    The Lindauer portraits have also been a wonderful source of inspiration for me. Thanks very much for the link.
  11. tonydawe A Fixture

    Country:
    Australia
    Hi Mike,

    Depending on the light source and light direction, this figure can look too dark, too light, too orange and too brown almost simultaneously. I do appreciate that you can only judge what you see on your monitor, and to your eyes it looks a bit orange - which makes sense as I'd just done a light wash of Burnt Sienna over the skin. I've just been out to the local arts supply store to load up on Raw Umber, Van Dyke Brown and Sap Green on the advice of my mentor Phil Walden. I'll try to break up some of the mono-tone skin colour with a bit of red and green as you suggest. Thanks mate.
    Mike - The Kiwi likes this.
  12. tonydawe A Fixture

    Country:
    Australia
    Thanks Einion, I wasn't planning on using black in the moko paint mix anyway. It's not historically accurate. Moko inks were traditionally very dark green/ brown in colour, and while they can appear black from a distance, they are more dark green than black in reality. According to my research some of the pigments used to create the tatoo inks were sourced from dog faeces. Imagine injecting that into your face willingly!!:inpain:

    Hi David and Jamie,

    I'm trying to raise the bar for myself on this bust. I feel as if my painting skills have "plateaued" a bit lately, and I need to step up my game. Sometimes I just go through the motions a bit and churn out an OK piece (to my eyes), and on other ocassions I try to set a new standard for myself. (y)

    This is one of those busts. Glad you like my progress so far and thanks for commenting.
  13. PHIL WALDEN Member

    Tony, go back to your art supply shop,an old style W/N oil colour TURKEY UMBER ,a colour you'll use for ever, if you find a tube, to discribe the colour, you'll just have to see it, then you'll know....worth the hunt..
  14. tonydawe A Fixture

    Country:
    Australia
    Turkey Umber- that's a new one for me mate. I'll drop into the arts supply store and see what they've got. Thanks once again cobber.
  15. housecarl A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Coming along nicely Tony.
    Carl.(y)
  16. Einion Well-Known Member

    In the mix Tony, wasn't suggesting using black by itself. You blend black with ochre or yellow and you get green, so you can see how it might be used right there.

    And like I mention above black can work really well in fleshtones; if you want to up your game in terms of colour mixing then I'd highly recommend spending an afternoon playing with black in all sorts of mixtures. There's no real secret here, you'll find very quickly that all that's necessary for successful results is to use controlled amounts.

    Yes, so I've heard... at least they burnt it first! But even so *shudder*

    Einion
  17. tonydawe A Fixture

    Country:
    Australia
    Hi Carl, thanks for your comments mate. Love the latest avatar too.

    Hi Einion, I've always avoided using black in my fleshtone mixes because I dislike the "coal miner's face" look of the high contrast painting style and feel it's an unnatural colour to use on the face and hands. It also has a tendency to create grey when mixed with lighter colours - maybe I'm just not doing it right.

    As you can see from the attached pics, I got busy last night with the Raw Umber, Olive Green and Rose oils last night to generate some variations in the skin tones. I am trying to break up some of the monotone elements on the skin and create some variations. As Phil Walden said earlier, once the moko goes on the face, it will significantly darken the overall look of the face. I've also painted an acrylic base coat for the hair.

    Attached Files:

  18. Mark S Guest

    Looks great Tony,...this will be an excellent piece I'm sure.
  19. Einion Well-Known Member

    I do too. That look is from using it to excess (huge excess IMO), particularly if it's applied on top of fleshtones in glazes.

    This is why I keep emphasising not using it to excess, using controlled amounts, using it in mixtures.

    That's exactly why you use it, for the greying effect - shadows are generally slightly lower in chroma (duller) and using black carefully in mixtures is one of the best ways to achieve these colours*.

    Like the new fleshtones a lot, I think that's a big improvement (y)

    Einion

    *Overall it is far more effective than using any form of mixing complement which I can get into in detail in a future thread if you're interested.
  20. Jamie Stokes Well-Known Member

    Country:
    Australia
    Progressing nicely Tony,
    using the oil mixes you have has really added tonal life to this piece....

    For a simple character study, this has so much to say, and so many areas - the skin tones already touched upon, the moko, the feather based cloak...oh wow...

    And it's good to see you striving for better...

    Cheers

    Jamie

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