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Hussar preview

Discussion in 'Sculpting' started by Gra30, Apr 3, 2015.

  1. mick3272 A Fixture

    I agree this is getting out of hand, If you like the model for what it is buy it. If you like it for what you can convert it into, buy it. If you are not happy with it then leave it on the shelf. At the end of the day its still a great piece of work, keep it up both.

  2. waterloo1815 Active Member

    WELL SAID Waterman & Mick!!! Way too much rivet counting going on here!! My motto - If ya like it buy it - if you don't like it move on!! Dave
    Gellso, Waterman, Gra30 and 1 other person like this.
  3. Mat Lambert A Fixture

    Fantastic news - will be great to start seeing these painted
    Gra30 likes this.
  4. martin tabony Well-Known Member

    I've never "fenced" I've only ever used a sword in a military context. We always "closed the fist" in order to protect the thumb. I believe in fencing you are trying to score points. We were taught to "scrap" so there was as much chance of using the hilt as the blade! Better still get his foot out of the stirrup, and deck him!

    Bye the way if this beautiful figure is based on a character in a film. Then as long as he looks like that caractor, does it matter, if the sword is held slightly wrong, if it's because the actor held it wrong? Or if the costume department miss counted the buttons forty years ago? They're all easy fixes if you think it will be more historically accurate.
    I'm expecting to see this figure a lot!:)

    theBaron, peedee, Waterman and 3 others like this.
  5. stu A Fixture

    I really don't understand why people feel the need to portray themselves as experts !!!

    This is a figurine,,,,it looks like a French hussar . it isn't even released !!!!

    Why do people need to find fault if its going to be commercially released and vent there underpants at it. If it was a one off nobody would have bat an eyelid,,,superb,,,great is it commercial,,,, is what would have been posted. Instead we get this !!!!

    I know graham well and I bet he is well ****** off, I would be !!

    I don't know whats happening on PF lately but its easy to see why Facebook is becoming popular even with all the other rubbish.

    Chin up gra ,,its the dogs kahoonas mate and is gonna fly off the shelves.

    DEL, Babelfish, baronband and 7 others like this.
  6. ivopreda A Fixture

    strange positions sometime...

    do you prefer a beautiful figure wrong or a beautiful figure as correct as possible? I know many people that don't buy figure because wrong.

    I think the forum can be helpful to share ideas and documents, it is't true that everything was good in the period.
    Specially if you do something in parade dress where the rules were respected.

    when I read that the figure was in progress I wrote for some better interpretation... on a finished figure I prefer to avoid any comment

    that's my point of view...free to think different
    theBaron, Jaybo, pgarri27 and 5 others like this.
  7. stu A Fixture

    I happen to agree with you Ivo,,,,Yes it should be correct , but can you prove 100% that it is not.

    Would it not have been polite to private message graham with your thoughts, so avoiding these issues. The figure is not in production it is a preview. This could have been dealt with privately.

    I have done this myself with another manufacturer,,,

    Scotty, Waterman, Gra30 and 2 others like this.
  8. martin tabony Well-Known Member

    Stuart, I thought this was a discusion thread where people could give their opinions. I'm sure Graham knows how to tell people to "turn to the right and fall out".! :D
    Gra30 and Funky50 like this.
  9. Funky50 Guest

    I say Martin steady on old chap....I think I Sussed out how we managed to get the better of those Frenchies at Waterloo.....LOL......Kevin
    martin tabony, Waterman and Gra30 like this.
  10. Funky50 Guest

    By the way even with some perceived issues flagged up by Ivo this will still be on my Euro list to buy as I really appreciate the lengths people like Graham and Stu go to to give us these study's for us to paint ,I decided a while back 100% Historical accuracy is less important to me than a persuing my hobby of painting Military figures and to be honest we really are mega spoilt these days when I look at some of the older stuff in my grey army...keep it up Graham and Stu and MMM without you guys there would be no buttons or rivets to count...Kevin
    theBaron, Waterman and Gra30 like this.

    In response to Stu's comment - There is a significant difference between critiquing a one off and a commercial release. A commercial release is a product being put up on the site for marketing purposes and to gain wide approval to stimulate sales. I am personally more likely to make a critical comment on a commercial product than an individual's one. Nevertheless I generally don't make such comments re anatomy, balance, finish etc. because it would be needlessly negative and unproductive. If I see a uniform error or inconsistency I am more likely to comment.

    In this case, the comments by some members have been focused on the technical details of hussar clothing, including the ability to wear three separate braided items, as well as minutiae like which regiments had buttons set in threes vs fives.....BTW Never heard that one before and I will be reseaching it further. I would consider these comments to be constructive. I learned something despite spending the last 40 years reading Napoleonic history and uniformolgy, with a strong emphasis on hussars.

    I seriously doubt whether any of the questions asked here will affect Gra's sales adversely. Its a great figure, with a superb face and demenour.....I will be getting one for sure. Anyone who is retentive enough to let whether a gilet, dolman and pelisse could be worn together impact their buy decision will already have drawn their own conclusions and will have made their buy or hold off decision without this thread. I actually think that manufacturers acting in an overly defensive and annoyed manner may have a more profound negative impact on sales than such technical quibbles. Credit to Gra who IMO has taken the high road, despite some probable frustration, and has wisely not gotten drawn into the arguments here.

    I recall a recent 3D print bust of Mad Jack Churchill where some very detailed critical comments were made on bow mechanics and design which led to some revisions in the master. The manufacturer was appreciative of the feedback and welcomed the comments. I guess this ability to make late changes is another advantage of 3d sculpting.

    One way to avoid this sort of post-completion critique and the attendent frustration would be to show some WIP shots as the master is sculpted and to ask for comments. Although that would likely give away some market intelligence of future releases to other makers. Pros and cons.

    Just some thoughts.

  12. TADATSUGU Guest

  13. TADATSUGU Guest

    Colin. The reference to the different rows of buttons shows up in a number of my books. Most reliable is probably Rousellot but also Bukhari's Osprey book and the Histoire and Collections books.
    martin tabony and Gra30 like this.

    I guess every Historex or Metal Models of these regiments ever done is wrong then :)

    Also, I'm not sure how that jives with the actual 5th hussars dolman and gilet Ivo posted earlier in this string (from Musee de L'Armee). I attach the famous 5e manequin from the Brunon collection for ref. Also Detaille's famous painting of the 4th Hussars at Friedland shows buttons in fives - I don't think he was a research slouch either. Maybe shows that good research may involve more than referring to 20th C books and plates? Or perhaps that we really don't know which rules were applied hard and fast.

    Thanks David

  15. Inaki Active Member

    Hello, Everyone!

    I see this is getting a bit too tense...

    1. I started my post congratulating Moz and Gra for what I consider the best Hussar figure ever.
    2. I am sure that Gra is happy to read comments, suggestions, etc... when he posts a preliminary version of a new delivery. Perhaps sometimes we become rivet counters, but a lot of debate means a lot of interest too. Moreover, as a customer, I feel free to comment, suggest... even if I alway thank the Artist for what I consider a gift to the buyer.
    3. I would like to know how to use a sword in a military context without any knowledge of fencing. It's like being a rifleman without any knowledge on shooting! Probably both the rifle ad the sword can be military used in the same manner!!! - Just a joke, don't take it seriously ;). I wanted to mention this because even a 1796 heavy sword needs to be managed with a "non rigid hand". It was a good intentioned comment and far from a corrosive critic to this piece of Art.
    4. I finished my comment ordering a figure I have felt infatuated by at first sight.

    I'll say it again: what Moz and Gra offer us is a true gift. I love the work you do guys and I hope the comments here made are simply helpful and, being this a fórum, I want to think they are all welcome.

    Kind regards,

    martin tabony, Waterman and Gra30 like this.
  16. TADATSUGU Guest

    Well said Dave and I realise your comment is made with the best intentions. But surely it is the other way around. If someone is going to buy a model regardless of fault, why do they need to get involved in the rivet counting discussion? More a case of if you do like it, buy it and move on, to me.
    I am not trying to tell anyone what they should like or buy. As far as I am concerned I can't get enough rivet counting. The main benefit I get from this site is the ability to ask questions and learn stuff. I would not get this if all I did was to only comment on what I liked, nice as it is to do so.
    If I wanted to buy a model of a period that I had little knowledge of, I would welcome someone pointing out what was wrong with it, so that I could then correct it -What is wrong with that?
  17. Martin64 A Fixture

    Its good to have people like Graham that put their creativity and money into new releases like this and I am sure this Hussar will find it`s customers. I also appreciate people like Ivo that offer their historical expertise which might enable producers like Graham to consider some last minute changes or motivate people like me to research some aspects of the figure and convert certain details if needed.
    Graham announced that he will provide his references for the figure btw. I am waiting for this reply. That`s what I like about PF - great figures and hobby-related discussions. No need for other posts - but maybe we need another "Brutal Honesty"-subforum where replies other than "great, superb, kiss-kiss" etc can be taken by the person that puts his sculpt/next release on display ( I am sure - Graham will be one of them:)).
    Cheers, Martin
    Gaudin, martin tabony and Gra30 like this.
  18. custer760 Well-Known Member

    I will buy this figure because it is beautifully sculpted,I am sure (because I know Grahams castings are superb) it will be a great casting,and I will enjoy hours of painting and at the end of the Day the People who see it wont give a s__t if there are 2 or 3 Buttons more on it or if his underpants,undershirt or what the frigging else is showing!!!!! Enjoy this peice of Art and paint it!!! For g__s sake Men.Graham,please pay pal me a receipt at. jacqpeter@web.de and I will gladly pre-pay for this beauty.....I want to paint him!!! ;-)
    Gra30 and Tarracus like this.
  19. Gra30 PlanetFigure Supporter

    Thanks everyone, I do honestly take all comments kindly and also appreciate the interest and kind words :)
    As mentioned it is a euro release so we have a few months and I too am always thankful to any door opening for more information. I am very glad I posted this now, nothing is more disheartening than more information after the moulds are done and a figure released. I also appreciate immensly the work and research moz puts in, if I can tick all the boxes or a least try to I know we have done our best.
    I have had a couple of messages which I am grateful for, when released it will be a new set of images showing the complete piece as available.
    Peter, many thanks, I don't take payment up front but I will post information when he is available.
    I hope none of us fall out over this, it's not worth it :) as we all share the same passion and I can see it from all angles, I appreciate every comment.
    All the best
  20. BarrieHynd Well-Known Member

    To me it seems simple enough, if you like it buy it, don't like don't buy. I WILL be buying this one as I see this as an excellent sculpt and in a scale I like. Having a few figures from CGS in the past I know I will be getting a quality cast figure for my cash. Perhaps some comments should have been done by PM as suggested in an earlier post. I sure do hope that CGS does go ahead with this release so I can buy it and he doesn't get too disheartened about the way this preview has gone.
    martin tabony likes this.

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