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Cr01 Cgs Royal Marines Light Infantry Bugler 1914

Discussion in 'Figure News' started by Gra30, Dec 1, 2012.

  1. taffjones Active Member

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Great sculpt mate, Will you be doing any Naval brigade Matelots?
    carl reid likes this.
  2. Waterman Active Member

    Cracking figure Graham, to be presise I agree with you, 1914 , 18 War is the more correct title, but everything is spot on for that period. Buglers wore that rig on board ship, as part of RM Landing Parties, ashore in Barracks, and Barrack Guards.In the trenches on the Somme, later on in the war,they were dressed in khaki the same as the Army. In 1958 at the RM Depot Deal, Buglers still paraded in Blues No 3s, full fighting/ marching order, carrying side drum and bugle. At that time it was issued khaki and then had to be blackened with boot polish and shined, in line I believe with the Light Infantry Regts of the Army, other Regts /Corps blancoed theirs with pea green blanco.
    carl reid likes this.
  3. Barke02 Active Member

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    What a cracker!

    Well done Graham and Carl!

    Cheers,
    Jon.
    carl reid likes this.
  4. carl reid A Fixture

    Country:
    England
    Thanks Guy, for all your kind, positive and generous comments!
    I'm glad you like him!
    I hope he sells through for Graham. He is a true gent, and pleasure to work with!

    Carl
  5. carl reid A Fixture

    Country:
    England
    You are right mate the Respirator was not issued until 1915, as Graham said he just added the wrong date.
    I always try not to add a date where ever possible except for WW1 or The Great War, as the equipment changed so frequently, its almost impossible to keep up! Its probably the most influentual 4 years in Military History!
    They went from the relatively ordered battles on foot and cavalry charges, to mechanised, airial and chemical warfare!

    Carl
    housecarl likes this.
  6. Waterman Active Member

    I like this figure very much. Carl has really captured the character of this lad. I served with boys just like this one, indeed I was one joining at 15 and away to a ship at 16. This was in the 50s and we did have awfull haircuts done by a RM Bandsman who wielded the scissors for 2 pence, that was when you got 240 p in a pound. Our ears did stick out like Carl has portrayed, emphasised by the style of haircut ie hacked off. We were institutionalised, most boys coming from Orphanegs s, Training ships, and some from Remand homes, but not all, a lot were from families where fathers and grandfathers had been or still were RMs. The Navy and RMs in particular loved to get these boys, as they were easy to mould into the type of man that was required. Carl mate, a fabulous portrayal of a period now lost for ever, and thank god for that, but it did produce real characters such as you have shown.
    carl reid and Jimbo like this.
  7. Bootneck Well-Known Member

    Love the Brodrick cap which is unusual to see. This is on my wish list. Great choice of subject. I hope Graham has more RM subjects in the pipeline.
    carl reid likes this.
  8. Richie A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Hi Graham/Carl,
    A lovely sculpt should prove a big hit. I have alway thought this would make a great figure too just keeping on the WW1 theme. Boy Jack Cornwell VC
    cheers
    Richie
    Boy Jack Cornwell.jpg
    carl reid, crf and billyturnip like this.
  9. housecarl Moderator

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Lovely piece.
    Look forwards to the box art,
    Carl.(y)
    carl reid and crf like this.
  10. carl reid A Fixture

    Country:
    England
    then
    All I can say is thank you for your very kind and generous words!
    I did try to portray a young lad thrust into the killing fields of The western Front, and how he and these poor souls must have felt being faced with, what for thousands was certain death! Even if I managed to achieve small percentage of that, then I'm a very happy boy!!!

    Thank you once again for your kind words!

    Carl
    crf likes this.
  11. taffjones Active Member

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    My joining Division was named after him.
  12. Dennis Active Member

    Country:
    England
    Cheers Carl, this guy look like he is going to be a big hit for you and Graham, look forward to more mate.
    Thanks for taking the time to post.
    Dennis
  13. martin tabony Well-Known Member

    Country:
    United-States
    I thought the strap was from the Royal Navy 1880s-90s version of the general service haversack, it could be worn over one shoulder or fastend to the the back of the leather brace straps so that it was worn on the back (see Sudan campaign etc.) These things were quite often worn mixed with newer kit like the 1908 webbing.
    I'm not sure about the red patch behind the badge though, it should come from behind the browband of the Broderick cap, not sit on it.
    Martin

    Attached Files:

  14. Waterman Active Member

    You may well be right in some instances, I have seen various depictions. As Carl has sculpted the cap, that is the way it is shown in one of the Osprey books. Also that is the way Charles Stadden showed it in a series of paintings that he did of RM uniforms from 1664 onwards. In 1923, the RMLI and the RMA, were amalgamated to form the RMs and a lot of annomalys in Dress were handed down to the Divisions, ie Chatham,Portsmouth,Plymouth and RM Depot Deal.The way the Blue cap was brushed, was different in each Division, as was the pleating in the greatcoats, and even down to Bugle Calls, and Drum Beatings. Could this be another example ? You only have to look at the present day Drum Majors uniform to see it is a composite of the RMLI and the RMA. and yet again Musicians serving on the Royal Yacht wore a different tunic to the rest of the RM Bands. What I am saying is, given the complexity of Dress , it can be a minefield. So yes , you could be right, but there is plenty of evidence to say Carl is not wrong.
  15. Gra30 PlanetFigure Supporter

    photo (19).jpg
    Thank you for the post Martin,

    The strap is definately the respirator as Carl sculpted it that way as mentioned on an earlier post, although as mentioned I incorrectly dated him a year early and should be 1915 onwards.
    I have tried to show these images as best I can and to lighten them, if looked on the original at full pixel it can be seen from the profile that the red patch does cover the blue considerably more than on the image you posted, infact they all appear to be different. The right as looking sat down crossed legs in particular and the other I have added. I saw the same image as you posted when searching on google and it is indeed on the first page, the other image is obviously a drawing and again any particular cap could have been used as the basis, although I do not see any like that on this picture.

    When I served in the RM things also changed considerably over time depending on who manufactured the items. Our pith helmets went through 3 makers at least in the 24 years I was in and every time the shape changed, the caps did the same and as I was leaving the latest caps had another 1/2 cm added to the band in height. The biggest change was when redoing the latest drums earlier this year for the whole of the RM and to discover for many years we had been using the wrong blue, when changed it was somewhat of a shock to what we had become accustomed to. For many years I saw paintings of buglers wearing their dresscords loose across the chest and always thought it was an error, we wore ours on the third button, later while serving I found some photographs and the pictures were correct and at some time we had obviously changed things.I say this a possibly the design of each cap was different, especially if different makers and during the time and so no example can be used as a 100% bench mark.

    For many reasons we encountered problems, and including tailoring, although we as RM ( serving at the time) knew the norm, no SPECS had been made, the guidelines for which every item should be made. Often until they had been rewritten we had to go with what was provided as every manufacturer had a different interpretation, or be left with no equipment. A change of manufacturer meant start again or provide correct SPECS which generally were then written using the basis of what had come before. The new guy wrote the SPECS honestly from what he knew, that then became the norm and why so many 'not in my day' conversations happen when meeting our old and bold, dare I say due to lack of it being documented as correct, although they had far greater things to consider than the coreect location of a red patch. As Drum Major I wore a split cap badge, the placement of the top of the Laurels is clearly stated in the BR ( Book of Reference) but no mention of location for the Crown if split, nor the Prince of Wales Plumes I wore, so we did as WE thought right.

    As an interest some SPECS had to be rewritten and had not been touched or investigated since the 1800s and before and this gives me all the more reason to think that 1914 onwards was no different. It was a bit of a nightmare for me as I was Drum Major training and responsible for the fitting of all new entries and RM School of Music including Ceremonial Uniforms, best job in the world if I am honest ,:) although the closure of the RM Tailors at Deal followed by the use of Tri Service Tailors compounded things with a lot of specialist expertise lost.

    The centre figure is also a good example of how the white caps were still quite rigid as on the bust. This may be a white canvas top cap but the picture is dated 1918 and so if it is a cover then is fits very tightly and shows how little work is needed to produce the white version, either cover or canvas.

    Thank you though for showing the images as I also believe that as modellers the more information the better.

    I stand by this sculpt as I think Carl has done a fantastic job of a figure I have wanted for many years. Take any of the below characters, compare the look and uniform of these and our little Bugler and for me he has captured him perfectly.
    Best wishes and kind regards
    3333.jpg
    111.jpg
    2222.jpg
    Graham
  16. Nap Moderator

    Country:
    England
    Hi Guys ,

    Great posts with some really intersting comments .....and images from all

    Nap
  17. martin tabony Well-Known Member

    Country:
    United-States
    I stand corrected, as I said I was not sure. I had only seen the type of Broderick where the patch is almost like a folded back peak. I know what you mean about issue kit, Queen Victoria was a long time dead when I was in but we still had some helmets with Victoria's crown on! And there's still mucking about with the tunic colour.:)

    Martin
  18. Gra30 PlanetFigure Supporter

    Cheers Martin,
    No correction needed and as said the more information the better.
    Best wishes, my first brasses had a Kings Crown as did my Drum Major staff until 2010.
    Take care mate, as you can tell, a special figure for me
    Kindest
    Gra

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