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Bust scales?

Discussion in 'General Figure Talk' started by NeilW, Jul 5, 2019.

  1. NeilW A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Re-posted from discussion ref Dolman's Grey Wolf bust,

    It may just be me, but why do so many 1/10th vs 1/12th scale photo comparisons seem to show such a big difference in relative size?

    The ratio 10:12 equates to 0.833, so a 10cm bust in 1/10 would reduce to 0.833 in 1/12th (wouldn't it?).

    Yet, looking at the Dolman Wolf Girl (and other similar product photos) the ratio seems to be more... in this case c10:7.58 which makes the smaller version equate to 1/13th

    See below (measurements are from my screen, not the real thing)... or have I got it terribly wrong?

    WG.JPG WG2.JPG
    MCPWilk likes this.
  2. theBaron A Fixture

    Country:
    United-States
    A scale for busts, eh?

    Well, I believe that if you want to weigh a bust, you really need to hold it in your hand. There's not really any other way.

    :D

    Prost!
    Brad
    cinimod, Mirofsoft and NeilW like this.
  3. Forté A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Much of it depends on how much of the body the sculptor also shows. Also on how reliable the sculptors measurements are. With figures it's easier.
  4. NeilW A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    That shouldn't really affect scale (ie 1/10 vs 1/12).

    But my pic above shows comparative shots of the same bust in two different scales but, as explained, the 1/12th looks disproportionately smaller.
  5. valiant A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    I think most sculptors have their own dollies/mannequins that they use for figures or busts, so that, at least their own ranges are "en suite" - whether they fit in with others' is not really a consideration. It only seems to matter when figures are used with vehicles, etc, the discrepancy becomes more evident.(y)
  6. Martin Antonenko A Fixture

    Country:
    Germany
    [IMG]
    Nap likes this.
  7. NeilW A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Yes agree: but my original question is about the larger that I would expect difference between two busts from the same sculpt from the same manufacturer.
  8. NeilW A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Already exists: they go from AA to K.
    theBaron likes this.
  9. valiant A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    I dont think that the majority of figure painters get too hung up on scale - Theoretically, it shouldnt be, but in reality, scale is a pretty inexact science, . If people like it, theyll buy it, regardless. Many manufacturers use several different sculptors for their products, so I suppose, a slight difference is inevitable.(y)
    Forté and DaddyO like this.
  10. DEL A Fixture

    Country:
    Scotland
    Personally I don't give a monkeys about same scale variation. Basically I buy what I like usually without paying any attention to scale.
    If I have a preference it's for 1:12 but don't get excercised if one is bigger or smaller than another.
    Figures are a bit different though. I'm currently preparing a vignette using a Pegaso, a Scale 75 and a Romeo figure. These all differ slightly but I sent a bit of time choosing themand will arrange ina way to disguise the slight scale differences.
    Forté and valiant like this.
  11. NeilW A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Not an issue for me either as I'm more of a full-fig person (when I can get around to doing anything that is).

    But, as said, I'm genuinely curious as to why there is an apparent mis-match in scale between the same bust from the same manufacturer (in this case Wolf Girl from Dolman, as below).

    And, yes, I know the issues around full-fig scales (54mm; 1/35; 1/32 etc)

    WG.JPG WG2.JPG 0.75
  12. peedee A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    I'm 'just curious' why you think this is even an issue?

    You claim their representetive illustrations are out of scale relative to each other ?
    So what?

    Surely this only matters if:
    1) The actual piece is cast incorrectly.
    2) you plan to interchange a fixed scale item,
    ie a weapon from one manufacturers casting to another.

    In this case, as a free form non-uniformed piece, it can
    make little if any difference.

    It's a poor example and methodology to illustrate a
    poorly argued point.
    Just curious.
    arj and DaddyO like this.
  13. NeilW A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Peedee,

    I'm not saying it's an issue for me and I'm not criticising the bust per se, but if something purports to be in scale x vs scale y (as here) and it doesn't appear to be so then it's a legitimate question. However, it could be a real issue for someone who wants to build a collection in one (or more) 'true scales'.

    As the photo below shows, this also seems to be the case with Dolman's Hal Moore bust (and without measuring them up. other busts on the Dolman site), so it seems to be a systemic, perhaps intentional, phenomenon.

    As I stated in my original posting, my logic/maths may be wrong* but so far nobody has proven it to be so.

    *the most obvious may be that the publicity shots are composites of two photos and are reproduced at different sizes?

    I've now asked Dolman direct (via their Facebook) and will report what the response is.
    Dol-1b.JPG
    theBaron likes this.
  14. peedee A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Of course it's an issue for you....
    you raised it as an issue !

    BUT......

    WHY.?

    IT'S POINTLESS.

    No one cares.

    If we like them we buy them.

    It's another non issue.

    Jeez .

    I am seriously done with this thread.

    Ffs there ARE real issues and you raise
    pure B.S.
    DEL, Banjer and DaddyO like this.
  15. DEL A Fixture

    Country:
    Scotland
    Do many of us really care? Most tend to follow a sculptor or a theme.
    I took early retirement when the fun went out of my job and was replaced with pointless debate and inactivity.
    I'm sorry to say I feel this is the way pF is going. It's become a much duller place than it used to be and in the past few years we have lost a number of highly regarded members who are still very active in our modelling world..
    I just can't get my wee head round (see what I did there ;)) some topics, the place is becoming a debating society.
    Helm, arj, mick3272 and 1 other person like this.
  16. NeilW A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Thank you Peedee a well argued and rational response to a genuine enquiry.
  17. NeilW A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    For what it's worth Dolman have replied stating that 'it is possible 1/13'

    They then add that the quality of sculpting and casting is good, which I don't dispute and '... what else is a little smaller or bigger' (perhaps trade descriptions?).

    They/he then suggest that I should buy one to see '... if it is correct or not'.

    I don't intend doing the latter (not into either fantasy or busts) but I think that in light of no further explanation it seems a peculiar and avoidable error that has occurred at the production stage (and from looking at their site, to varying degrees, more than once).
  18. Forté A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Are you working your measurements from actual busts or photos?

    If it's photos you'll likely find it's just one bust photo resized rather than the actual product.
    peedee and valiant like this.
  19. NeilW A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    As I said, I'm working from the online promotional photos and did note that their scaling may be incorrect. However Dolman have not suggested this and acknowledge that the true scale may be 1/13.

    There is of course the alternative that the 1/12 is correct and the 1/10 is oversize.

    As you intimate, measurement of the actual busts would confirm, or not, my observations. Comparison with the actresses' actual height and body proportions would confirm which, if either, scale is correct (except of course, this seems to be an unlicensed portrait of an unspecified person: but, let's not go there again it seems to upset people).
  20. NeilW A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Hi Peedee, you say that you are 'seriously done with this thread', then give a like for a contribution that makes a point I have already made.

    Strange that you are still following something that you find 'pointless' and about which you believe 'nobody cares'.

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