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1st Empire Cuirassier

Discussion in 'Napoleonic War' started by Bailey, Oct 22, 2015.

  1. Bailey A Fixture

    Country:
    United-States
    mick3272 likes this.
  2. Ron Tamburrini A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Something doesn't look quite right with this .
    crf likes this.
  3. megroot A Fixture

    Country:
    Netherlands
    Agree, Looks like a reanactment cuirass, in the wrong colors.

    Marc
  4. Bailey A Fixture

    Country:
    United-States
    Is there a reason you think that? Could you elaborate on what doesn't look right? This piece is being sold at auction by a reputable source, so I expect they've had it evaluated by experts in the field. Here is their description:

    "French. Steel helmet body, dated "1812" on the reverse, embossed brass comb with black horsehair tuft and plume, brass chin scales. Bearskin turban, brass trimmed leather visor, 11" red feather plume and the liner are modern restorations. The cuirass with a heavy steel breast plate with brass head rivets and proof stamps. Has a dent from a musket ball on the right front waist. Iron back plate with similar proof marks; leather backed brass shoulder scales and an older replacement waist belt. Includes a contemporary red quilted vest and display stand. Includes a folder of supporting research.

    Condition: Good. Helmet has been cleaned and with restorations as noted. Cuirass with light age toning and service wear."

    And Marc, what colors are you referring to? Here's a reference image, looks the same to my eyes.
    [IMG]

    I'm not an expert in this field and, if there is something wrong with the artifacts, I'm genuinely interested to know what. But, for now, I really don't understand your comments.
  5. Ron Tamburrini A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Well I was right , the helmet is a restoration , it was posted as authentic , I am not so sure about the brass straps on the Cuirass also as they look a bit new .

    But with all these things a auctions ; its buyer beware .
  6. Ron Tamburrini A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Here is what I have for ref . IMG_2179.JPG 10247352_611415715611787_2990958350441468643_n.jpg

    Just as a little footnote ; hear is a picture of napoleons Bicorne in a Berlin museum which is reputedly worn at Waterloo . did he actually wear this one at the battle ; not so sure as there are others kicking around boasting the same .
    IMG_6034.JPG
  7. ACCOUNT_DELETED A Fixture

    Country:
    Canada
    One problem is that the display lining distorts the appearance. Colour is right but that is all.
  8. Paul Kernan A Fixture

    Country:
    Canada
    Another shot from Les Invalides to add to the file

    Attached Files:

  9. Ron Tamburrini A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    Huge difference in quality , but this is an officers cuirass and helmet , but no doubt authentic . I have seen this at the museum and it is a splendid piece .

    ron
  10. Huw63 PlanetFigure Supporter

    Country:
    Switzerland
    Time I caught up on this forum. Cuirass is the wrong shape around the shoulders, the dent (proofing mark) is way too deep and the front and back don't appear to line up. The lining could come out of the Star Wars set, the helmet crest shows sides of early empire with the front of a late empire crest. I hope whoever bought these items knew what they were buying .

    A belated tuppence worth.

    Cheers

    Huw
    peedee likes this.
  11. Claude Portsmouth Active Member

    I see it sold for $4312.50. I think a genuine period piece would have fetched more than that?

    Claude
    peedee likes this.
  12. Huw63 PlanetFigure Supporter

    Country:
    Switzerland
    I saw something at around 30-40,000 euro recently but that seems to be a reproduction price. As a comparison a genuine Waterloo medal sells for about £2,000 today.

    Cheers

    Huw
  13. peedee A Fixture

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
    If you look at the front of the brass crest and closer at the shape of the helmet two things seem evident.
    Firstly the overall shape with ut's bacward leaning rake is of Minerva design.
    With the peak also bring fur covered, I think this is an officers helmet of about 1813 and used in 1814.
    The addition to the crest of a royalist silvered cartouche does add evidence to this possibility.
    From 1815, The Kings Garde du Corps, Les Mousquetiers de Monsieur also wore these helmets with a white plume.

    So......this could be a Royalist Garde du Corps Helmet recycled by a Cuirassier officier that survived Waterloo.
    As such......I say original with a great history.

    This Cuirass looks fine to me but new shoulder scales would give the item a longer service life legitimately up to the 1870's or even beyond.
    Why would you throw away a perfect cuirass and order a new one when repairing it within the Regiment is easy.

    Love all this

    Paul.
    stoffy01 and Huw63 like this.
  14. smudger1960 PlanetFigure Supporter

    Country:
    United-Kingdom
  15. Huw63 PlanetFigure Supporter

    Country:
    Switzerland
    The only thing is that the cuirass lacks the etched line which provide ann inner line and border with rivets midway between this ine and the edges of first enpire cuirasses. For gerneral officers and above the line might be shown as laurel leaves but this would be on all lines. Thus I believe the cuirass is more recent than first empire.

    Cheers

    Huw
    peedee likes this.

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